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Zirconia just joined the Susan's Permaban Club!

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Complete:
From Zirconia:

--- Quote ---And I feel promulgating false information to be irresponsible. But I guess that is beside the point.
--- End quote ---
I think it is much more than just irresponsible. It is dangerously selfish.
It puts the self feelings of the liars above those of those genuinely seeking truth and quidence.

karen_A:

--- Quote from: zirconia on July 18, 2020, 07:11:04 PM ---
It saddens me that you feel laughing at a situation that is ridiculous indicates absence of understanding, empathy or heart.

--- End quote ---

Were you laughing with Complete's quote or AT it?

Why would someone getting hurt because of an on-line conversation be ridiculous? It happens... some times badly.


--- Quote ---While discussions on the boards have greatly confused me, they never made me cry.

--- End quote ---

Years ago it happened to me a few times. There are times in transition when one's self confidence can be at a very low ebb and one can be very vulnerable to some things.



--- Quote ---On the other hand, I've cried through the night until the morning more times than I can remember over the pain of what I was about to do. The price I knew I'd pay.

--- End quote ---

Often one can't know for sure what that price will be (or how things will turn out no matter what you do) , but fear the worst ... which was the case for me.


--- Quote ---And Complete was there the whole time, every time. With me, at the other end of the line. Offering no platitudes, but just the truth.

--- End quote ---

The truth as she sees it... Sometimes truth is relative and sometimes absolute when it comes to life. It's not alway clear which is which.


--- Quote ---During a brief private interaction between Elisabeth and myself she also offered me the truth. And concern about what she believed might be mistaken motivation. Knowing there was a possibility I might hate her for that.

--- End quote ---

Some of your posts recently made me wonder about something like that-  I thought about asking you some pointed questions...

I debated a couple of days if I should bering it up. In the end I decided we did not have enough of relationship to do it, and I figured, given things you have posted, it would likely not have been seriously considered.


--- Quote ---It really is of no concern to me what you think of me.

--- End quote ---

Then I'm glad I did not bring the thing up! ;)



--- Quote ---Let me close with a quote I gleaned from the research that ultimately led to my ban. To me it crystallizes the message of everyone who has been assimilated to those still searching.

It isn't about age dear. I requires a willingness, an anxiousness to let go of the old mind-set, to recognize you are "starting over", and to be willing to start from ZERO. The more a person tries to hang on to the less they will "transition".

--- End quote ---

NorthernJane... She posted regularly on a different forum I have been on a very long time. She posted regularly there from 2007 to 2014 so i know a bit about her... or did (memory is not what it used to be ;) )


--- Quote ---Is that not a clear message of hope?

--- End quote ---

Depends on one's situation.

-karen

zirconia:

--- Quote from: karen_A on July 18, 2020, 08:05:06 PM ---Were you laughing with Complete's quote or AT it?
--- End quote ---

Hi Karen

I was laughing at the memory of the pain and confusion within whose vortex I was being torn apart. The memory of the confusion that was intensified by the well-meant pontification on the boards, and belittlement of what I felt essential. And of the relief that the truth "as Complete sees it" brought me.

The mixture of relief and pain, actually... although the new hurt was of a completely different nature.

If the pain I'd always felt was that of having a scarred-in stake through my heart the new pain was that of pulling it out. Because on seeing it I saw that to heal it would need to be removed. And that I could not survive unless it was.

So... to me at least there was no comparison. The advocacy on the boards to leave the stake in place was a source of confusion, which did exacerbate my pain but was not its cause.

I hope that helps...
If I think of something to add later I may.

Edit: Clarity

Complete:
Zirconia,

*

A popular meme of the trans world is that "transition" is different for everybody".
Spelled out in simple terms this also means that for "some" it works out better than than for others. Is that the fault of those that did happen to succeed?

And the fact is that those who have successfully moved beyond the trans world/condition just might have something to offer. Something they've gleaned from actually having survived the process and moved easily into the "non-trans" world. Carrying no regrets.... and no irksome reminders.....If others are just willing to listen.
In fact, l am sorry that so many find my words offensive.
I am sorry that l must stand by helplessly, unable to help, as so many forge ahead into the darkness and the unknown.

Edit - 04 Aug 2020 - Christine

Complete:
Quote from Zirconia:

--- Quote ---Let me close with a quote I gleaned from the research that ultimately led to my ban. To me it crystallizes the message of everyone who has been assimilated to those still searching.
--- End quote ---
From Northern Jane:

--- Quote ---It isn't about age dear. I requires a willingness, an anxiousness to let go of the old mind-set, to recognize you are "starting over", and to be willing to start from ZERO. The more a person tries to hang on to the less they will "transition".
--- End quote ---

Quote from Zirconia:

--- Quote ---Is that not a clear message of hope?
--- End quote ---

"Depends on one's situation."

-karen

I'm think this final statement from karen clearly and succinctly highlights the importance of context.
Clearly in the context of Zirconia's situation, N.Jane's missive offers hope, albeit with caveat of a painfully high price. Apparently Karen's situation offers a different context. Hence a differing interpretation of Northern Jane's message

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