Gender Resolution

[Kirsteneklund7]

Hi everyone at TransRefuge,
 the crux of my issue is that my life is largely good, but I sometimes end up with an internal war between my masculine and feminine sides.

 How does one achieve Gender Resolution? How does one get clarification on whether to transition or not.

 When I was a child the inner girl had some expression and so did the boy - the conflict was minimal I felt no dysphoria.On Sunday I went to Sunday School- during the week I prayed that there could be a way I could be a girl.

 With the onset of puberty and natural androgens a male identity locked in. I consciously put away the girl & got on with life. She has visited me over the years but not in an insistent  and painful way until 2015. My feminine side was easy to ignore and suppress for 3 decades until age 46.

 The angst, unease & dissatisfaction drove me to a psychiatrist & psychologist. Therapy + HRT brought great relief & a sense of euphoria. I had not felt this good for years. This was November 2015.

 I thought I might be better off as my feminine self - I thought maybe I should transition. I didn't seek an official diagnosis on purpose- I wanted to go back to "normal" if I was wrong. My Gender Therapist challenged me about transition. At that stage I wasn't dressing & she asked me my feminine name- I replied Kirsten. She asked me if I wanted to start a transition. I said no- I don't know if it would work or whether it would make me happier.

 I tried to achieve clarification. I started exploring & expressing my feminine side more. Women's clothes part time, makeup, hanging out with the girls at work spending time with trans people. It felt liberating. My masculine side was still operating for work, being a husband, father. I thought I would just try and push the female envelope to see how far the rabbit hole went.

 I had laser on my face and body. Had electrolysis. Started skin care. Grew breasts - wore a bra, lost weight, started growing my hair.

Started practicing a feminine voice. I told key people ( friends of my wife so she had support).

 As I became more feminine and my wife noticed the change a train wreck started with family life. My wife and I kept talking and came to an agreement to stop HRT .

 In 2017 I stopped HRT - I had already curbed my drinking in 2016.  2017 was dedicated to a natural as possible existence - improving marriage and finding balance with my Yin & Yang.

 Through 2017 it took nearly a year for my endocrine system & mental state to become fully male again.
 The angst, unease & dissatisfaction started to return- I dealt with it in a gentle health positive manner- maintaining good physical and mental health as much as possible. People had told me if you don't have to transition then don't.

 That said on the first of January 2018 I was back on HRT until now. The inner woman can be gentle yet relentless. The distraction became an issue so I took the soft option of HRT - it really does take the edge off.

While I to and fro over transition estrogen is working its magic. I feel like I'm not misssing the boat. I like to hedge my bets - I dont have to transition,.... but I can if I want to. I insisted on full dose HRT - if I need to transition - then good - if I dont then good. My therapist calls me a fence sitter.

 My family life brings satifaction and I give quiet thanks every day-my life is largely very good.
I just wish I could gain solid clarification on transition - yes or no.
Can anybody tell me how does one obtain clarification?

 Kind regards regards, Kirsten. x

[Kirsteneklund7]

Whew! I like this version better......good edit!!

Allie

 I tried to break up the wall of text ! Now tell me Allie, you spent years managing the condition. Was it physical health that forced resolution for you?

 Yours, Kirsten

[Kirsteneklund7]

Yes, I managed my dysphoria all my life by expressing my female side as a mother and housewife, then when I was able, dressing as me full time at home for the last 20 years. It was working a treat until a couple of years ago when my dysphoria upped the ante, and made me very sick from Sept '18 to March '19 when I started HRT. The miraculous cure convinced everybody but me I needed to transition. I still thought I could manage it and tried to back off a bit, but Dysphoria made me sick again, this time only for a week until I got a stronger dose of E. I am in no doubt now that I am completely controlled by my dysphoria, and I have no say at all. I did get by without transitioning for 65 years, but I guess it was going to happen sooner or later. I suspect the longer you put it off, the higher the chance Dysphoria is going to kick your butt.

I have mixed feelings about putting it off so long, I think it's easier now to transition in public, but I think I maybe should have done it 15 years ago when I semi retired.

Hugs,

Allie

 I think you are right Allie. Expressing much of your female self stopped the wheels falling off for a long time. You successfully raised a family ( single handed ) and that can never be taken away. Hindsight is always wonderful isnt it. 15 years ago would have been nice to fully transition but it wasnt killing you then !

 I personally push the envelope until things go a bit pear shaped and then back off. I would love to go in much deeper and harder right now but family comes first( mine are only age 10 & 11 ). Im hoping to keep the wheels on like you did.

 Kirsten X.

[Kirsteneklund7]

Hello fellow Gender  Travellers, just putting pen to paper again for the record. (April 23 2019.)
One happy piece of news that is only a day old is a friend of mine whom I have known for a couple of years is a medical co-coordinator taking 000/ 911 style phone calls to dispatch air ambulances. She is a no-nonsense type of person that doesn't bear fools gladly and takes her job seriously.

 While the morning handover was taking place for the day, I happened to mention that under my work clothes I was developing a female body. I mentioned that I run on female hormones and in my spare time I dress in a feminine manner.

 She said yes come to think of it you do have breasts. She smiled and nodded to herself and asked if I was going to fully transition. I said I may have to in the end.

 She said well in any case you have my full support. You can come round my place for a beer and wear a dress if you want! In fact come round Friday and we will have a cold one !
 I said you're on!

 We also spoke about the " Rainbow " scene in Darwin and how it hasn't quite reached critical mass, regular get-togethers don't get many people.

 She just so happened to know of some trans people and really 'got it'. She really understands what trans is.

 In any case that's more than a couple of people in the office who know about me & could tolerate a transition.

 Looking forward to Friday evening. My wife knows where I'll be as well.

 The engineering crew mostly know and personal friends are supportive. The rest of the engineering crew have mixed feelings.

 In other news, yesterday afternoon I had an eyebrow and eyelash tint. I love the lash tint the most- at 50 years of age I actually have substantial upper and lower black lashes- I love it ! My wife says I look ridiculous and that men dont do that!  She said the work crew will think you are a weirdo!

Today the work crew aren't bothered or haven't noticed.

 Also my sons expressed that I shouldn't tint my naturally blonde brows and light lashes.

I plan on maintaining the tint- it looks quite natural, but it really adds a youthful/ feminine element.

So that's me, bits of the inner woman are starting to show and tying to avoid the train wreck of 2016!

 Yours truly,  Kirsten xx.

[Kirsteneklund7]

Hi Kirsten,

So how did that get together to drink a cold one with your coworker go? Did it feel completely natural? I'm also excited about the complement your wife gave you about getting your lashes tinted. I hope it made you feel good.

How do they tint your eye lashes? Is that something like have them dyed like you'd do with your hair? I might have to look into something like that. I have very sparse eyebrows, and eye lashes too.

xoxo
Lexxi

 Hi again Lexxi,
                 yes I did get round to my friends house that Friday night for some cold ones & a nice meal and it went well. There were other visitors at the time whom I didn't know so well so my presentation was more male than female. Even so it was good to just have a friendly yarn and get to know people. It is good to know if I must start living full time as a woman I can still interact with quite a group of people.
 
 Lexxi you should get down to the local salon for an eyelash tint and get your brows done. Women, Men, and between do it and they will be happy to oblige. Eyelash extensions should be available too. I found my first session I went too dark on my brows and got a bit of a shock with the contrast
 ( too much ). But get in there Lexxi you will love it!

 Yours, kirsten.

[Kirsteneklund7]

I am also very interested in how one does finally determine to the point of not having doubt/hesitation.  In my circumstance, the cost of even social transition will be STEEP.  I will likely lose my wife, my family, my house, my entire world.

I am still early in my awareness and I am wrestling like Kristen said to balance the inner feelings with the status quo to maintain my marriage/family.  My wife is of the mindset that anything I do to affirm the feminine side of me will lead to a necessary need to more (like some kind of self-perpetuating system).

So far my wife has allowed me the indulgence of doing minor things as long as they are not visible or known/knowable by others.

  Hi Claire,
            I didn't necessarily want to have to transition male to female, but ever since 1974/1975 when I first started school I had a desire to be a girl. I felt deep down I was a girl but I knew I didn't have a girls body and I was also very much a boy as well. I liked rough and tumble, I could handle bullies but I was soft and empathetic as well.

 I personally found most of my life has been a see-saw with the masculine and the feminine selves in fact as a child I was Christine and I was David these were personae I used in schoolyard games or when I sometimes dressed as a girl as a child. And no I wasn't insane or schizophrenic, I think it was just recognition of how I felt.

The end result for me was putting the girl away at age 12/13 was the start of a 30 year conflict that came to a head in 2015. I had to do something and that was the start of HRT at age 46.

 In 1987 when I was 18 years old I tried to get to the bottom of my trans feelings and I researched Sex Reassignment Surgery in the college library and read Jan Morris's famous Conundrum - I could really relate to his/her life story/feelings. She also transitioned with friends and family intact as well.

 For me Claire I find I must run on estrogen day to day and I must allow my feminine side to exist, this means my wife is often happy and often not. Every year I am more feminine and I feel good about it. I call it an organic transition and I still dont know where the end point is.

 I feel ready for SRS and have spoken to insurance, Surgery practice & psychologist. My wife is not in agreement(yet). Life on the whole is quite good none the less.

 With friendship, Kirsten.

[Complete]

Hi Kirsten. When you get back from the salon for an eyelash tint and gettting your brows done, l strongly suggest you take the time to read this and then give it some serious thought.

https://tgchatroom.com/wiki/index.php/So_You_Want_To_Be_a_T-Girl_%28Chapter_1%29

[Kirsteneklund7]

Hi Kirsten. When you get back from the salon for an eyelash tint and gettting your brows done, l strongly suggest you take the time to read this and then give it some serious thought.

https://tgchatroom.com/wiki/index.php/So_You_Want_To_Be_a_T-Girl_%28Chapter_1%29

 Ok Complete, now Im terrified( LoL). But does this mean I should stop hormones ect ? I have tried that in 2017.

 Managing the inner conflict is the key to surviving. I have been using estrogen and expressing my female self, - is that bad practice ?

[Kirsteneklund7]

This:

It's your life and live it the best way you can.
It shouldn't be influenced by anyone or any written stuff that doesn't feel right.
Only you know what's right and it's your decision how you want to approach transition.

I hope that it was understandable what I wanted to say 

 Thank you Thessa. I totally understand. But still that written piece was disturbingly accurate on many levels.

 I have read similar before.

 It is true, we can only do our best with it all.

 Kirsten.

[Complete]

Ok Complete, now Im terrified( LoL). But does this mean I should stop hormones ect ? I have tried that in 2017.

 Managing the inner conflict is the key to surviving. I have been using estrogen and expressing my female self, - is that bad practice ?

As l said. My suggestion is that you read the entire book, then consider what has been present Ed . Then act based on your best judgement

[Complete]

You might consider a low dose HRT to reduce the anxiety and perhaps allow yourself the space to find a workable solution which might keep your family intact.

[zirconia]

I would stay as far away from that terfy, trashy, bullshit story as I could stay. It's rather insulting and bigoted in my opinion.

Lexxi,

Which parts did you find terfy, trashy and bullshitty? I found the entirety to be written from the heart... and e.g. the bell story very much fit what I've experienced. To me the whole seemed to also very well mesh with the wall that we discussed elsewhere.

I felt the succinct transition instructions also very accurately describe what I found to be essential. Again, to me the "presentation" discussions that take so much space on every forum I've seen often feel superfluous. My sisters never read any such instructions. If anything I myself also had to learn to avoid acting and speaking like a girl... so I've always thought in the end all of that really comes naturally to any girl.

I do know people who themselves say they wish to only be seen or treated as women. They have no desire to change their papers or name. Or have surgery. They have too much to lose. I respect them for being able to find a way to balance their lives.

I also know from personal experience that if one has heard the bell one CANNOT stop. At anything. And it means being ripped apart and shedding bucketfuls of tears.
The baggage one needs to shed to even try to fly is affixed so firmly that removing it tears away the flesh...

Wanting to be transsexual is not smart. Trying to become transsexual is even less smart. If you can avoid transition and stay sane, taking that path is more peaceful...

And that, to me, was what the author wanted to convey...

What made you feel differently?
To you what did her message seem to be?

Edit: clarity

[Complete]

I would stay as far away from that terfy, trashy, bullshit story as I could stay. It's rather insulting and bigoted in my opinion.

Wow! Pretty strong would be putting it mildly. Bigoted and over top? Yes. Condescending and seriously misinformed? Yes, that too.
Lexxi, l really cannot give you an honest assessment of your comment without violating every TOS ever written.
"Terfy"? Hmmm...You realize of course that this was written by someone who actually suffered through TRANSition. Terfy??? Trans Exclusionary Radical Feminist. Hmmmm....
Trashy? You mean like your poorly thought out comment?
"B******t" Uhuh. Hmmmm....
Is that really the best you can do? Did you even READ it? Is that painful truth so terribly 😖😖 frightening that you simply close your eyes and ears and mind?

[Kirsteneklund7]

    Hi again Complete,
                                firstly I will say this, I dont get offended with HARD TRUTH answers. Also thank you for the link " So You Want To Be A T-Girl ". I have read it a few times.

 This message is about a question I have been meaning to ask but life has got in the way. I guess my question revolves around early onset and late onset transsexuals.

I feel I fall into that late onset category. I believe you are early onset or primary or true transsexual and so is Dena. I think the early onset experience and the late onset experience are distinct. Even though I am a late onset transsexual I have been dealing with the issue of my gender since I began school in 1975.

 At age 13 I thought I had a goal & a plan & a resolution to the conflict of my male and female selves. The answer to the problem at the time was to bury my female self & get on with life as a man. I manned up, did men's things, I studied engineering, I dated girls. I took mens jobs shipbuilding, comercial diver, engineer.  Dating girls was a mostly effective antidote to transness but when they got to know the real me they would ask if I was gay or they sometimes asked if I wanted to be a girl. Often I found it an effort to project the male persona they wanted. The male persona so they could interact as their feminine selves. On the surface I was very masculine, underneath feminine.

 From a young age I was always interested in women's issues, their life experience, fashion, gossip magazines ect. I always kept a pile of womens magazines on the bedside table from childhood on.

 At 18 years old I began to read about transsexuals like Jan Morris whose experience really resonated with me. Also Christine Jorgenson, Caroline Cossey ect. I also researched SRS in the university library. In a nutshell deep down I always wanted to be female, but logic and social obligation meant using willpower, physical & mental energy to be a man. This caused a degree of angst, inner conflict & distraction, but it was achievable & successful in many ways.

 Now a lot of people would say my issue is AGP or autogynephilia. I dont believe so. I didnt cross dress from the age of 13 to age 46 because I didnt feel the need. Dressing in feminine attire was never a turn on for me. Dressing and expressing my feminine side is a way of taking time out, time to just BE, time to drop the facade. It is not a turn on.

  One thing about this is my bell hasn't gone off (thank God ). I can still function and manage the gender misalignment/ dysphoria. I have been close to suicide but talking to key friends and family including my wife has brought me back from the brink. Obligation to my 2 sons future is a big factor as well.

 To be continued.... must go for now, Kirsten

[Kirsteneklund7]

 Just continuing from the last entry......

 In Darwin I have on early onset trans friend I have known for over 20 years & when I was on my knees in 2015 with a gender crisis she helped me get on my feet. She also helped my wife understand what was happening as well. It most likely saved our marriage.

 It has been interesting comparing notes with her. In her words she never transitioned, she was just a girl from a young age. As a teenager she just expressed her natural self, she was never a boy or a man. Hormones & surgery fixed the minor detail. She just lived as a woman her whole life. I imagine your experience was similar. I guess you were never a man and just lived life as your natural female self.

 I have read similar to " So you want to be a t-girl before " and also I am aware of the hard life of my trans friend had. Already I have experienced first hand the poisonous reactions of people who know I am trans. I am very aware of the effect on friends and family. In 2016 I started a full on transition to female  but found the damage to family and friends too much. In 2017 I got off estrogen and tried to be a normal man & father & husband. It proved to be too difficult, too distracting & the inner conflict became harder to manage. The beginning of 2018 I started HRT again and gained rapid relief.

 The HRT seems to not affect my appearance too much except breasts. Dressing androdgynous sometimes gets Ma'am.

 The thing is on HRT I feel like the same person I have always been but the world shifts around me. Peoples impressions are a bit different. People are sometimes nice sometimes nasty. While my comfort improves others seem to get uncomfortable. It makes me feel like I must hunker down & develop a thick skin.

 Should I transition ? I dont know. Should I give up HRT & feminine expression ? That is possible but difficult. Resigning myself to manhood could be done(depressing though).

 My intention is to remain on HRT & express myself as I see fit, I dont know where that will lead. When my boys are able to stand on their own 2 feet there may be a chance to let the brakes off totally.

 I wish I had your clarity of gender.

 Complete, have you seen many good late onset outcomes ? I suspect not.

 What is the best way to deal with late onset transsexualism ?  What I have seen is divorce/ end of family life, living alone and a desolate existence.

 I work hard & do my best to keep the show on the road, if I could step away from this trans stuff I would.

 I have been very fortunate in life, people like me often cant get married or have a family life. I have property & equity but could lose the lot in a heartbeat.

 I might not transition but how does one carry the burden ?

 It seems to me early onset transsexuals have no choice except to be women. I am not early onset.

 Transition may not even be a cure for me.

 I guess grin and bear it & be thankful is the key.

 Yours truly, Kirsten.

 

[Christine]

Hi Kirsten.                         04 May 2020

I don't feel qualified to give you advice; I am a late onset Trans woman. I'll ask Dena to comment on your thread, She's the expert, I'm Her assistant and trainee.

Ask me about an Orchie and I know all about them.

Take care Kirsten.

Best Always, Love

Christine

PS: I have to get a new avatar; that one is goofy. Will do it today.

[Kiera]

In my circumstance, the cost of even social transition will be STEEP.  I will likely lose my wife, my family, my house, my entire world.

Sorry, this IS confusing. Having just looked at date(s), and OP status, post deleted . .

. . "hello wall"! Just talkin' to myself AGAIN!

[Complete]

Hello Kirsten, and welcome to the Haven. Sadly, l have seen these questions before, many times, and as l have said too many times, there are no easy answers.
I'm pressed for time so I'll keep it short. You've already ennumerated many of your options and as you've noted, none are great.
At this point, and l HATE offering advise about things l've never experienced and only heard about, l would suggest considering a good and knowledgeable therapist and and a low dose regimen of estrogen. This is a relatively benign therapy and has been known to reduce anxiety and dyspepsia, (as well as severe dysporia)
It is not a "cure" and certainly far from perfect but it might allow you a chance to keep your sanity and family relatively intact.
This won't be easy, but it might work.
You have my very best wishes and will stick around here as long as l am welcome and able to contribute.
❤

[zirconia]

Kirsten,

I read your thread through, and see your pain. Again, I have no answers. All I can offer is to do something I usually wouldn't. Which is to ask some hard questions. I hope you won't mind. And... I have a request.

Transgender boards use a lot of shorthand expressions. Many are fuzzy. Dysphoria. Acceptance. Validation. Presentation. Expression... etc. Words and expressions control what you can say and affect how you feel. When I started to write in earnest I found the meanings attributed to them didn't match my thoughts and feelings... and that they had a tendency to transform everything into a homogenous mush. Easily "relatable" but lacking true focus.

If you would, I believe avoiding as many as possible of the words you've seen in frequent use on the forums just might help give a more clear shape to the thoughts these questions may invoke. Can you try?

The angst, unease & dissatisfaction drove me to a psychiatrist & psychologist. Therapy + HRT brought great relief & a sense of euphoria. I had not felt this good for years. This was November 2015.

Angst, unease and dissatisfaction... What triggered these? What were they about?

At that stage I wasn't dressing & she asked me my feminine name- I replied Kirsten.

What is the purpose of your "feminine name?"

I tried to achieve clarification. I started exploring & expressing my feminine side more. Women's clothes part time, makeup, hanging out with the girls at work spending time with trans people. It felt liberating. My masculine side was still operating for work, being a husband, father.

You describe a "masculine" and a "feminine" side as if they were separate. Can you elaborate?

Through 2017 it took nearly a year for my endocrine system & mental state to become fully male again.

What is a male mental state?

The distraction became an issue so I took the soft option of HRT - it really does take the edge off.

While I to and fro over transition estrogen is working its magic. I feel like I'm not misssing the boat. I like to hedge my bets - I dont have to transition,.... but I can if I want to. I insisted on full dose HRT - if I need to transition - then good - if I dont then good. My therapist calls me a fence sitter.

Full dose gives your endocrine system a female balance. Do you believe it possible to not transition while on it?

She just so happened to know of some trans people and really 'got it'. She really understands what trans is.

What is trans?

It is good to know if I must start living full time as a woman I can still interact with quite a group of people.

The "must" and "still" snag. What do you mean?

For me Claire I find I must run on estrogen day to day and I must allow my feminine side to exist, this means my wife is often happy and often not. Every year I am more feminine and I feel good about it. I call it an organic transition and I still dont know where the end point is.

Have you any idea or expectation where the endpoint might be?

Managing the inner conflict is the key to surviving. I have been using estrogen and expressing my female self, - is that bad practice ?

Here again it seems that you refer to "female self" as somehow separate. Is it? Can you explain how that came to be? And when?

What does "expressing" consist of? How would you compare it with what your wife or mother does? Or is?

In 2016 I started a full on transition to female  but found the damage to family and friends too much. In 2017 I got off estrogen and tried to be a normal man & father & husband. It proved to be too difficult, too distracting & the inner conflict became harder to manage. The beginning of 2018 I started HRT again and gained rapid relief.

What are the bounds of a normal father & husband? What is the difference between the male/female selves you refer to? How separate are they? How separate must they be?

The HRT seems to not affect my appearance too much except breasts. Dressing androdgynous sometimes gets Ma'am.

The thing is on HRT I feel like the same person I have always been but the world shifts around me. Peoples impressions are a bit different. People are sometimes nice sometimes nasty.

What do you think causes people's impressions of you to change on HRT if it doesn't affect your appearance much?

...Kirsten... I don't know any of the answers to the questions I made. They're just things that don't seem at all clear to me. Are they clear to you?

The single thing I found the most difficult to conceive was the "male self" and "female self" distinction. I somehow think that just might possibly contain a key...

[Complete]

Another suggestion it l haven't mentioned it.
Read The Transsexual Phenomenon by Dr Harry Benjamin